How Do I Spend $45,000, Updating my studio Options

[Mizzeh]

Hey,
I was just wondering what some of your opinions would be on how to spend $45,000 on new gear. I've already got a couple peices of great gear but I will be getting a new mixer and new monitors and slew of other upgrades...just wanted to know what you all would get.

Mizzeh.

[formatj]

What gear do you already have?
What sort of recording/composing do you do?

Do you need computer, sound card, software, sample library, pre-amps, microphones etc....

[Mizzeh]

The only gear I plan on keeping will be:

-Korg Trinity Plus
-Roland XV-3080
-EMU Turbo Phat
-AKG C414B-ULS Mic


I have but am not sure If I want to keep:

-Delta 44 S.C.
-MPC 2000XL
-amt 8
-ART Pro Channel Pre Amp

I would like to get:

-Logic 7 Pro
-A Neuman mic (not sure of which model)
-Mackie HR824 Monitors
-G5 2.5
- some new sound mudules
-plugins
-Motu 828

Would like to get but not sure:

-Pro Tools HD
-A 24 channel mixer (Not sure of what brand, would like something that really sounds clean but still has a little of that old school touch if needed)


I produce mainly R&B /Neo Soul, Hip-Hop but also Alternative Rock and Electronic.
examples for the R&B/Hip-Hop I make would be: a mix between Timbaland/Neptunes/Vidal Davis and Andre Harris

for the Alt Rock .....Bands like Cold Play/Lenny Kravits/Pilot

and Eletronic music I do is more in line with William Orbit (Madonna) / Rolo(Dido) So I'm trying to get gear that allows me to tend to all my musicical styles.
Thanks for givin me a hand with this.

Mizzeh.

[nreyes]

Give me the money and i'll see what I can do....

[Mizzeh]

would you like 20's or hundreds?? lol

[mikesilence]

Hi!

I would suggest to sell the Delta 44 and hold the other things, get the Apple and Logic, a Neumann U87, the monitors, a JV2080 (great sounding preset synth), an Access Virus and a Nord Lead 2 for the technoid sounds, Adam P22A monitors and as mixer a Ramsa DA7 (better sound than the Yamahas) or a mackie d8b. IF you can get one try to purchase a Soundtracs Virtua (have a look on my website), this is the best and most analog sounding digital desk I have ever heard and I am glad to have one...

If you want to know anything else, just email me...

Greetz,

Mike

This post has been edited by mikesilence: Fri 29 Jul 2005, 09:32

[ourmanflinty]

45 grand won't go that far, it sounds like a lot but you're tempted to go really big time and get all cutting edge expensive gear which will eat up cash quicker than a fat kid swallows sweets, an SSL and Pro Tools costs a lot of money.

Pro Tools and Logic, a HD1 accel with Apogee converters? You can always buy extra DSP cards, like say a 'massive pack' with bundled plug-ins. Stay analog and classic sounding with a mixer or make sure you have some tube gear and a good master compresser to warm up the clinical digitalness, and maybe a U48 with a matching mic amp. If you don't get a top mic amp don't get a top mic. Go for multiple screens on the mac. More than one pair of monitors, maybe 5.1? What about some dynamic mics and a couple of guitar combo amps to run your synths through? A roland space echo? A lexicon 224? AMS 1580S? Neve EQ? Valve mic? Do you want to buy my WEM copycat?

It's a minefield! You'll get more opinions than you can handle. If you go to a dealer please make sure you go to three or four and balance up what they all offer than let them fight amongst themselves for your cash money!

[aduan]

it seems that you will spend a lot of money on your studio , so why not buy a nice hardware reverbration? I think the nice reverb can make your music sound better , but in current software reverb still not good enough.

If I were you , i will buy some hardware reverb like Lexicon PCM xx,or TC systemxx.

[newrigel]

Here is a GREAT native System:
First... get a Quad G5 and put about 4 GB of ram in it $3200.00 Ram $1000.00 approx.
Use Logic 7 Pro or DP $700.00-$1000.00 (Apple hardware, Apple OS, Apple Application Logic= real solid performance) Plus it comes with a great set of plugs and VI's right out of the box! I use DP and it's great for guy's like us that use midi for compositions.
Convolution is just as good as a hardware verb and you can use multiple instances of it.
Spend your $$ on conversion (like an Apogee $2,695.97 or something along that line) and run a master clock on your system (like the Big Ben $1,345.97, this is VERY IMPORTANT for audio quality)
For a great front-end to your DAW get a Focus-rite Liquid Channel $3,295.97
Get a Magma expansion chassis $1,999 and put a couple of UAD-1's in there and get a PowerCore card too for the Oxford EQ's.$2000.00 approx.
THIS SYSTEM IS AROUND 12-15K and will hold it's own against a PT rig for sure! You will have PLENTY of $$ left for other things like a Mackie DXB or something like that hehe.

Proprietary System: Pro Tools, and is a windows supported application (which means it's not too good on a Mac anymore the way it used to be). Expensive Plugs, expensive everything. Bad midi support, ugly GUI the list goes on and on... What's so funny is the new version of PT has features that DP has had since it's inception...
Pro Tools is over hyped and the system above will sound just as good if not better (because of it's midi implementation and editing capabilities) for a composer like you. When you record bands and need to track 28 to 32 live tracks that's where PT comes into play but I would rather just track into ADATS and save my $$... HD's take a dump now and then and to have a really excellent take ruined by HD failure is just plain BS. DAW's are for POST not for tracking and when you have a HD take a dump on you while your trying to impress with your PT system your clients are going to find out the hard way in the end. $45k for the system I mentioned is easily attainable with a hefty chunk of change to spare!
One thing... plug-in count doesn't necessary mean a great song... great performances and creativeness is the key so if plugs and TDM make your talents better than thats just psychology @ work! The plugs in the system I mentioned are cutting edge and integrate seamlessly in your DAW. Blue Tubes plugs are really great too!

This post has been edited by newrigel: Sun 4 Dec 2005, 07:37

[gspeed]

English producers make me laugh!
In truth, you want a combination of two things. Software and hardware. They all combine this in their own way. Anyway, my way is simple but a little more expensive. This will let you sound as good as timberland! (none of these guys ever managed to be THAT clean and precise) and also any other proper modern sounding artists and engineers.

First if your spending this kind of money, forget software problems.Just be prepared to spend 50 000! Buy logic it is relatively inexpensive(remember computer is just a glorified tape recorder). Buy a decent interface (ie fireface, metric halo, top end motu), you will need good A/Dconverters to hear anything at this level of detail. Monitors are a personal choice... GO WITH WHAT SOUNDS GOOD TO YOU. I can recommend Dynaudio, Klein&hummel etc. DO NOT buy the mackies as they have shit detail and will reduce your ears to pulp! (trust me I know).
You will need a good hardware monitor controller to keep software at 0db (true monitoring, as software faders reduce bit rate as their level is reduced!) Your looking at around 6000/8000 sterling.
For peripheral stuff, this is simple, but you are sorted with this.
NOW for the main bit... THE ONLY HARDWARE MIXERS TO GET WITH YOUR KIND OF MONEY are NEVE and SSL consoles. Around 45 000 pounds. These are the desks that make top ten hits, and always have been. Without this you are just playing around. Without this you are going to struggle to get the sound you want. Personally at this price I would go with SSL's AWS 9000 console, and make my studio a top one... Fully automatable, digitally controlled, no more crap software routing bullshit, and a sound that focusrite could never produce, liquid channel or no liquid channel. Only neve could compete at a higher price.
The alternative if you don't have enough, is to find a vintage one second hand. This will still pee over anything you could buy in the average store.
Good luck,
G.

[newrigel]

English producers make me laugh!
In truth, you want a combination of two things. Software and hardware. They all combine this in their own way. Anyway, my way is simple but a little more expensive. This will let you sound as good as timberland! (none of these guys ever managed to be THAT clean and precise) and also any other proper modern sounding artists and engineers.

  First if your spending this kind of money, forget software problems.Just be prepared to spend 50 000! Buy logic it is relatively inexpensive(remember computer is just a glorified tape recorder). Buy a decent interface (ie fireface, metric halo, top end motu), you will need good A/Dconverters to hear anything at this level of detail. Monitors are a personal choice... GO WITH WHAT SOUNDS GOOD TO YOU. I can recommend Dynaudio, Klein&hummel etc. DO NOT buy the mackies as they have shit detail and will reduce your ears to pulp! (trust me I know).
You will need a good hardware monitor controller to keep software at 0db (true monitoring, as software faders reduce bit rate as their level is reduced!) Your looking at around 6000/8000 sterling.
  For peripheral stuff, this is simple, but you are sorted with this.
NOW for the main bit... THE ONLY HARDWARE MIXERS TO GET WITH YOUR KIND OF MONEY are NEVE and SSL consoles. Around 45 000 pounds. These are the desks that make  top ten hits, and always have been. Without this you are just playing around. Without this you are going to struggle to get the sound you want. Personally at this price I would go with SSL's AWS 9000 console, and make my studio a top one... Fully automatable, digitally controlled, no more crap software routing bullshit, and a sound that focusrite could never produce, liquid channel or no liquid channel. Only neve could compete at a higher price.
The alternative if you don't have enough, is to find a vintage one second hand. This will still pee over anything you could buy in the average store.
Good luck,
G.

Software: Logic 7 or DP (DP has done more hit records than an SSL I can guarantee that... Danny Elfman scoring, Chick Corea music, Mike McKnight Madonna, Mariah Carey, Celine Dion etc. etc.) An SSL is a mixer board and you can mix ITB and use summing amps to get that same sound so I dont want to hear all this need a console shit.
Hardware: Convolution is the wave of the future in music and audio production... Sintefex 2000 or 8000 will sample any sound and do it nicely... have you heard one? or a Lunch-box to treat CRITICAL TRACKS!

Yes, SSL's are nice... but you don't need an SSL to make a hit record man, now that makes ME laugh!
Just plain raw talent and be @ the right place @ the right time!
I've heard TONS of platinum albums done on other gear besides an SSL...
SAVE your $$$ and do what you feel is best for YOU!
This SSL is going to cost you an arm and a leg man and unless this is a commercial facility maintaining this console can get quite expensive as time goes on. Stay virtual it's only going to expand as time goes on and this desk thing is all just personal taste it's not concrete. You'll be amazed @ the songs you hear that sound excellent that were NOT mixed on an SSL!
Oh yeah.. monitors are subjective so listen to ALL the monitors you can to find the one that YOU'LL be comforatable with over long periods of listening.

This post has been edited by newrigel: Sun 4 Dec 2005, 17:46

[gspeed]

Firstly SSL's sound is not replicable. Second, they now do outboard aswell, thirdly I am twenty seven years old and grew up using macs. I learnt programming languages from an early age. My introduction to production (being a musician in the first place) was with Reason. I now use logic and ssl. Go figure. You say the future is digital... guess what a young man will tell you youre wrong!
The future is a marriage of hardware and software. I'm afraid neither tube nor algorithm can provide real warmth, depth, and punch. Warmth and punch comes from transistors. Guess what? SSL make the best transistors!
As a guitarist (one of many instruments I play) I also know that a couple of tubes is a joke! Guitar rig sounds like shit, so does guitar amp pro in logic... amplitube just about passable. If younger producers like me would rather listen to Carlos Santana than to an engineer waxing about something that we have all grown with since we were kids... There is a reason. Those tunes sound FAT. Same with Jimi, etc... If they still sound fat today, it is because Eddie Kramer would know how to maintain a neve or trident.
Timbaland, the neptunes etc. also love hardware. Tunes are littered with loose jangly triplets generated by hardware samplers such as the asr10. OK, maybe plenty of plugs are used(which I actually take for granted these days), maybe some valve grit, but those mixes will sound as good as Mr. Kramer's a good forty years from now. Why? THESE PRODUCERS (FROM DRE TO PERRY) KNOW THAT MONEY CAN BUY BADASS TRANSISTORS. ONCE AGAIN, software is cheap and easily obtainable. Everyone has it. Hardware is OUT OF REACH for most people's budgets. But if you can do it, do it. SSL is one thing that you may regret, but your sound never will. Besides, it probably won't loose its value either way.
P.s. You speak of raw talent. Well, it seems you are very much an engineer. I think this kind of advice is damaging for the next gen. who all know their machines better than you! Why don't you try some raw talent of your own and start moving some faders without a mouse! Then you may become a little fitter to record that young raw talent you speak so highly of. I'll say it again. When you drop a software fader you loose bit depth, resulting in a loss of quality. This means you are now no longer mixing in 16 or 24bit or whatever. What does it take to show you guys?