A Look At Arabic Music Scales, This is very intresting Options

[bandar]

Hello Mac Musicians.... :-)

I am a new member and this is my first post...

I am a music composer from Saudi Arabia (I have nothing to do with terrorism or politics) and i came to find that most musicians in the western world do not have a good idea about the richness of arabic music...

I am so much in favor of arabic music, because it is very rich in term of scales and styles... as i studied music, i came to find out that western music has two main scales (major and minor) and few other sub scales (as harmonic and jazz and few others i do not recall). On the other hand, Arabic music has over 8 main scales, and a total of 99 (main and sub) scales... not to forget that a new scale was invented (and certified) three years ago, taking the number to a total of one-hundred scales.

Western music is based on the (half tone distance), Arabic music is based on the (quarter tone distance) meaning that between every two notes (next to each other like C and C#) in the western scale, there is an extra note in the arabian scale...( which is C "half sharp" )

One other great thing is that the two main western scales (Major and Minor) are among the eight main scales of arabian music, fitting perfectly with the other ones, and named AJAM for Major and NAHAWAND for Minor...

One good website explaining Arabic scales is : http://www.maqamworld.com/

the word MAQAM is the arabic word for Scale (or Key signature).

this website is listing 40 of the 100 scales with MIDI and Notation samples and i think it is a very good resource for learning about Arabic Music...

Let me know what you guys think......

Enjoy,

[guitartabbooks]

Hey,
That was great. Thanks for sharing that.
Other good scales to learn for dissonant, or far eastern sound are diminished, hungarian and harmonic minor.
I favor the harmonic minor as shown below in the key of A.
A Harmonic Minor (Gypsy Scale)
A B C D E F G# A B C D E F G# A
e :-----------------|-----------------|-------4--5------|
B :-----------------|-----------------|-5-6-------------|
G :-----------------|------4-5-7------|-----------------|
D :-----------------|-6-7-------------|-----------------|
A :-------5-7-8-----|-----------------|-----------------|
E :-5-7-8-----------|-----------------|-----------------|

Or, as played in guitar licks for example:


h p h p s
e :-5-4-5-4---------|-----------------|-----------------|
B :---------6-5-----|-----------------|-----------------|
G :-----------------|-7-5-4-5-4-------|------------2----|
D :-----------------|-----------7-6---|------------2----|
A :-----------------|-----------------|-8-7--------0----|
E :-----------------|-----------------|-----------------|

[jayzen]

Very interesting indeed.

I have been listening to some arabic music lately at a local cafe where the owners have a great CD collection, they are always playing music from their home country and the arabic world.

My question, is - is there a sense of Harmony in arabic music? You mentioned that there are many scales and notes between western notes. I am quite used to hearing singers and musicians play along these scales, but I don't recall hearing much harmonic movement, although perhaps I am not "tuned into it yet."

Curious?
Thanks

jason

[bandar]

unfortunately, arabic music can be recognized as a solo performance... harmony is very rare... most composers concentrate on the main solo and they change from one scale to another and back but after the main solo is composed, usually comes the instermant arrangement without any base that can act as a harmonic company... if base is madeup, usualy will sound like the drums...

once i have time, i'll upload in my personal site some midi samples

:-)

Jayzen, am sure you are a good musican that will hear the harmony if it was there....

[jayzen]

Hi bandar,

Thanks for your compliment, yes I guess I would have heard it if it was there - just wanted to be sure. The solo performance aspect is very interesting, I have heard music of this type, where the male vocalist is singing up and down the scales and very emotionally involved. One new album they have acquired at the cafe I visit has a 20+ minute song with the singer going up and down, up and down a scale, there are no "chord changes" but he is building something estatic and it really involves the listener.

It sounds very spiritual and a real unique type of expression. Is this type of performance improvised or are these passages written for singers to perform? (hope I'm not being too general)

I guess the descendent or branch of this type in the west is flamenco singing, I think some of the flamenco singers are singin the notes in between our half tones also, as well as bending and sliding through notes as well.

Modal music would also be similar I think because of an emphasis on the solo performance, the scale, and a building of long passages without interruption by chords...

-j

[waleg]

Hi bandar,

I really like what you wrote on the arabic music. I'm inviting you to write on WALEG.COM about arabic music, you can send me your article, and i will be glad to publish it for you under your name

Thank you

Ziad.

This post has been edited by kaboombahchuck: Wed 28 Apr 2004, 01:52

[bandar]

this type of performance is improvised by the talented ones... they just let out their feelings ... and after the performance, someone might write that as a sheetmusic and start to reperforme it...

new artists just follow the big ones.... they can improvise, but they might screw-it-up ... they might move to a new scale and not be able to go back to the original scale... in this case, they might not be able to complete the song... it might be their last day singing...

it is safer to follow the experienced ones... because they sound and feel much richer ... that is for you jayzen...

Ziad, thanks a lot.... i need some time to prepare it ....
give me a while ....

[waleg]

Hello bandar,

I hope you prepared something to publish it for you on WALEG.COM, i really look forward to hearing from you, My brother is a musicans and i also believe you might do something together

Ziad

[alxonline]

hi everyone!

my name is alx and i'm from romania.
i would have a question..as i assume u do know a lot of arabic songs and singers.

well, back in 1999 i heard an arabic song that was sang by a woman who was dressed up as Cleopatra (the video), laying down on something inside a pyramid and the video also had some war scenes! i saw it a couple of times but I CAN'T remember WHO SANG it!

if someone can help me track it down, write to me at alx-online@go.ro
thank you!
i really appreciate!
alx.

[Jaysee]

Hi,
One of the best resources I've ever come across re scale construction from a 'western' classical point of view, is Nicholas Slonimsky's exhaustive "Thesaurus of scales and melodic patterns", it must cover just about every possible permutation of notes under the sun! I know a few 'jazzers' friends who've found it useful. I'm sure someone told me that John Coltrane studied it for a while, but I may be wrong.
Also the guitarist Allan Holdsworth had an instructional video/book published a few years ago outlining his unique, personal take on what he termed the 10 most useful scales for improvising (although they barely scratch the surface of what that guy plays, amazin' player!) It's called "Just for the curious" That one is well worth a look for keyboard players as well as guitarists.

[Dimora]

What a great post!

I've been a huge fan of Middle Eastern and Asian music for a very long time now, I've even taught myself some Cheb singing. It has enriched my compositions and instrumental techniques in ways most European music hasn't taught me. Just by listening to it, you will start to notice how much space is between our European half step and how simplistic our understading of rhythm is.

It's starting to become a more popular style, sound and form. Even hip hop tunes are starting to use lots of samples of tabla and dumbek patterns (albeit, just little clips), which is great! It's a great way to educate the public. Unfortunately there is probably no thought on the basics of what they're sampling, but still it's a good improvment

Anyways, thank you for the site bandar!!! I can't wait to study it!

[Ambeintz]

yeh,sounds great .
I've heard people use lots of reverb on pianos playing arabic scales,which works very well,as an accomp. for lots of diferent styles of music.

[younes_uk]

hi everybody..

arabic music seems great and rich..i had studied the main arabic scales and the subscales..they are more than one hundred, some of them sound indentical, and they differenciate in the way the player use them..and of course every scale stands on 24 notes( the total notes of two octaves including the quarter tones) therefor the name is to be changed for instance: Rast is the arabic C major, Nawah is the arabic G major...so instead to reference the music tuned on C or on G...we call it, this music is on Rast, this is on Nawah.
what do you know guys about moroccan music??

all the best.

younes_uk

[elle]

Hello Mac Musicians.... :-)

I am so much in favor of arabic music, because it is very rich in term of scales and styles...

this website is listing 40 of the 100 scales with MIDI and Notation samples and i think it is a very good resource for learning about Arabic Music...

Let me know what you guys think......

Enjoy,

In additiona to the different scales, doesn't Arabic music use different tunings?

I've got an older Kurzweil, and it lets you select various tunings, one of which is a generic "Arabic" setting. I have no idea if this is authentic not though!

Do you do stuff with different tunings?

This post has been edited by elle: Mon 30 Aug 2004, 22:33

[Presto]

Thanks for helping us get our musical blinkers pushed out
Now the world is so small, we have no excuse for keeping them on.

I wonder what a group of Chinese/Arabic/Scot musicians would come out with in a jam.

[Cameron Powers]

Hello Mac Musicians.... :-)

I am a new member and this is my first post...

I am a music composer from Saudi Arabia (I have nothing to do with terrorism or politics) and i came to find that most musicians in the western world do not have a good idea about the richness of arabic music...

I am so much in favor of arabic music, because it is very rich in term of scales and styles... as i studied music, i came to find out that western music has two main scales (major and minor) and few other sub scales (as harmonic and jazz and few others i do not recall). On the other hand, Arabic music has over 8 main scales, and a total of 99 (main and sub) scales... not to forget that a new scale was invented (and certified) three years ago, taking the number to a total of one-hundred scales.

Western music is based on the (half tone distance), Arabic music is based on the (quarter tone distance) meaning that between every two notes (next to each other like C and C#) in the western scale, there is an extra note in the arabian scale...( which is C "half sharp" )

One other great thing is that the two main western scales (Major and Minor) are among the eight main scales of arabian music, fitting perfectly with the other ones, and named AJAM for Major and NAHAWAND for Minor...

One good website explaining Arabic scales is : http://www.maqamworld.com/

the word MAQAM is the arabic word for Scale (or Key signature).

this website is listing 40 of the 100 scales with MIDI and Notation samples and i think it is a very good resource for learning about Arabic Music...

Let me know what you guys think......

Enjoy,

I am so happy to wake up this morning and find these posts!
I live in the USA in Colorado but have traveled and studied and played my arabic oud (fretless lute) through Egypt, Syria and quite a few other arabic countries. I have never enjoyed myself so much! I also feel that the richness of the arabic music world is a great treasure waiting to be more fully discovered.
I have written a book called: "Arabic Musical Scales: Basic Maqam Teachings with 2 cd's" which teaches 45 of the most used scales. Entering into this world of exquisite musicianship is well worth the adventure: so many new emotional mixtures to explore! Keep posting! cameron

[MacFeegle]

hi everyone!

my name is alx and i'm from romania.
i would have a question..as i assume u do know a lot of arabic songs and singers.

well, back in 1999 i heard an arabic song that was sang by a woman who was dressed up as Cleopatra (the video), laying down on something inside a pyramid and the video also had some war scenes! i saw it a couple of times but I CAN'T remember WHO SANG it!

if someone can help me track it down, write to me at alx-online@go.ro
thank you!
i really appreciate!
alx.

Your description sounds like it could be Natacha Atlas <http://natachaatlas.net>. Ms. Atlas was born in Belgium, but has roots in Egypt, Palestine and Morocco. She ranges from traditional and/or classical to modern and has also worked with a group called Transglobal Underground. I had the pleasure of hearing her in person a few months ago and strongly recommend her music. Even if it turns out that she is not the singer you are thinking of, she's well worth listening to. I am curious to know if, indeed, she is the singer you're thinking of and, if so, what the song was that made such an impression that eight years later, you're still thinking about it. I'd like to hear it.

Thanks to everyone for this thread. I love arabic music and am pleased to see the discussion. Thanks, as well, for all the links.

[Thea Hardy]

I also love Arabic music - years ago, some students at my university taught me some songs from their countries, and turned me on to a Lebanese album - singer Fairuz - that was a start. But I have simply never had enough information on the topic. I would love to see this topic expand - the unique rhythms and scales seem to speak to me despite any political considerations. Music is a universal language.

[alxonline]

Your description sounds like it could be Natacha Atlas <http://natachaatlas.net>. Ms. Atlas was born in Belgium, but has roots in Egypt, Palestine and Morocco. She ranges from traditional and/or classical to modern and has also worked with a group called Transglobal Underground. I had the pleasure of hearing her in person a few months ago and strongly recommend her music. Even if it turns out that she is not the singer you are thinking of, she's well worth listening to. I am curious to know if, indeed, she is the singer you're thinking of and, if so, what the song was that made such an impression that eight years later, you're still thinking about it. I'd like to hear it.

Thanks to everyone for this thread. I love arabic music and am pleased to see the discussion. Thanks, as well, for all the links.

wow, i had posted my question in 2004 lol..
yes, it was natacha atlas! i was quite surprised coz i knew some of her songs already.
anyway i found the video on youtube (praise technology!), can be seen here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gi6CA_1TGns
it might not look (or sound) like much now, but it was very impressive for the then 14year old me
thanks a lot for your reply!
cheers!

[sabinablack]

HI all, i am a new member to this forum. I have gone through this post and like to say something. I am not a big fan of Arabian Music , because i have not many sources to collect . But i heard some songs and liked much. It seems that the music is only made for those Arabic lyrics. Your post again remind me and i will listen those songs again . Thanks you.