Help With Software Only Setup For Film/orchestra, Software, Orchestra library, etc. Options

[henryaz]

I'm a composer who years ago got tired of the distraction of technology and sold all of my synth equipment. I much prefer to work with traditional scoring. I've been lucky enough to have some of my works performed by professional bands, orchestras, and choirs.

I have an opportunity to write an orchestral score for a VERY low budget film, an opportunity I've been seeking for a while. My desire was to write the score and have the producer find someone else to realize it (hiring an orchestra is out of the question). His inquiries to his studio contacts failed to produce any takes, and he doesn't want to go the live musician direction -- even if the film was scored for chamber size.

So, I'm exploring the feasibility (from a cost & time point of view) of realizing the score myself. Here are the potential constraints and opportunities:

- Supporting a family of 4, I can not lose money on this proposition. So, what I get paid needs to cover the cost of my equipment. Once I determine what the costs will be, I will propose a contract that covers the purchases plus a little for myself.

- My priorities:
1) Quality of the final product;
2) Cost
3) Ease of use

(everybody's priorities, right?)

- I'm focused on a realistic orchestral output that I can sync to the film. I'm not interested in lots of bells & whistles. I don't even need real time output of the final product (but real time rough preview would probably be a necessity).

- Ideally, I'd like to be able to use the accumulated equipment & experience for future projects, too.

- My current (and relevant) equipment:
--- Emac G4 800MHz 512MB Superdrive with not much free hard space. OS 10.2.8 (an external fire wire hard disk is at the top of my wish list)
--- Sibelius 2.1.1
[Pretty sparse, eh? I should mention that 2 years ago I sold all my PCs and accumulated music software, too, to switch to Mac...]

- My first task is to score and realize a 2 minute trailer. If all goes well, all indications are that he'd hire me to do the 90 minute film. Therefore, it's conceivable that I could make a partial purchase of what I would need and have the trailer costs cover that, and then make more purchases once I had an agreement for the full film.

So, keeping in mind that this is a low budget film, what would be possible (and what are my tradeoffs) with, say:

- $500 (anything?)
- $1000
- $2000
- $4000

Thanks much!

[lon kennedy]

You gotta use the Garritan Personal Orchestra. It is the best for the least amount of bucks and allows for typical orchestral techniques and articulations. I'll let you read for yourself. See www.garittan.com

Cheers

lon

[mpmoceri]

Ion is right, use Garritan Personal Orchestra. You emac is the same spec as my iMac G4 800 and I run Logic Pro with no problem. If you want a complete, affordable set-up that you can expand on later I'd recommend:
1. Logic Express - $299
2. MAudio 61es semi-weighted USB Keyboard - $199
3. Garritan Personal Orchestra - $249

Logic Express gives you limited scoring I believe and sync to Quicktime. I believe $750 might cover your requirements for the Trailer. You can upgrade to Logic Pro when you sign the film deal... The maudio board is USB, so you shouldn't need a separate midi interface. You still might need an audio interface and some monitors if you don't have them already. Good luck.

[Dimora]

I also agree wholeheartedly with Ion. Garritan is the way to go for affordable and great sounding samples.

I have never used Logic Express so I am not sure if it will give you the adequate syncing you'd need. I use Digital Performer which is ideal for scoring but also pretty pricey. In the future I highly recommend investing in it.

I think mpmoceri has a good game plan for you though You will have all your bases covered with the what he's suggested and I know Logic Pro should more than cover any scoring needs.

Word of advice though, Garritan is pretty big and likes to gobble RAM. How much hard disk space do you have? You're going to need a bare minimum of 2GB for Garritan alone. 512MB of RAM isn't ideal for Garritan but it will do (I have just over that and manage alright by upping the buffers).

Also, I am not sure how fast you are with entering notation (since you said you work in the traditional mein of scoring and have Sibelius) if you are looking to REALLY cut corners you could export MIDI files into Logic or your proggie of choice and manipulate them that way but a Keyboard is pretty important....almost crucial. You will also need to have an understanding of MIDI modulation (e.g. expression) - that can be pretty daunting to deal with at first.....I think I may have said too much lol....Just a suggestion though that's how I used to work in college because I didn't have room for a keyboard in my room.

[Jaysee]

Hi, you say you have or had 'Sibelius'; I believe the latest version (4?)has a very impressive bundled orchestral sample library and full midi playback of scores. maybe you could give that consideration as you are familiar with Sibelius already. I guess Sibelius' nearest competition from pro scoring standpoint is Coda's Finale, but I've heard its a pig to learn

I agree about the Garritan value for money+ it comes with a nice freeware reverb too
There are quite a few orch. sample libraries around lately..The Vienna set is probably the most comprehensive,but as you arent sure if you'll get paid for ths film job I'd go for the Garritan personally. (Check out some of the Mp3 downloads on their site...especially Die Zauberflote overture! Also impressive Rite of spring excerpt.. amazin' woodwinds.
regards, Jaysee.

[stratology]

http://www.apple.com/pro/music/elfman/

[henryaz]

Thanks much for the feedback, folks. This is what I've come up with for my film composing:

Current setup (for latecomers):
- eMac 800MHz, 512 MB, not much free disk space
- OS 10.2.8
- Sibelius 2.1.1
- (and I forgot to mention before) Yamaha P80 keyboard, Midisport 2x2, & Oxygen 8

What I've decided to add:
- Logic Pro, $999
- Sibelius Upgrade with Kontakt Gold (don't know if KG will be helpful or not) $218
- Garritan sounds, $249
- external hard drive, $279 for LaCie external 250GB d2 extreme (7200 rpm, firewire 800 for if/when I upgrade my eMac, which currently uses firewire 400, I believe)
- RAM upgrade - extra 512 MB to take it to 1GB: < $200

Total expenditures, around $2000

Final thoughts?

Thanks much!

- Henry

This post has been edited by henryaz: Wed 25 Aug 2004, 17:05

[majn]

You will struggle Running Garitan on your emac.

It takes a MINIMUM of 1Gig memory.

I have one at home Running Logic Pro with I gig of memory and unless you freeze the virtual instrument tracks - or turn them into WAV files quickly then you will constantly get audio card errors and crashes (not terminal crashes - just annoying error messages in Logic). You won't be able to run much more than 3 parts at the same time.

I'm not dissing the Garritan - because I run it on a G5 up at the studio with 4 gig of Ram and it really is the baby - great sounds - really usable with Logic Pro - just very hungry on Memory.

Everything else you are doing looks great and I wouldn't fault it - I would just question whether your eMac can run it if you are doing big orchestral multipart arrangements. You will need to upgrade your eMac sooner than you think.

Cheers
M

[lon kennedy]

Henry,

I think that you are well on your way with your chosen hard/soft ware. For me, Logic has been great for 5 years. I'm a Wintel
convert to G5, like many others.

One of the coolest things about Logic Pro is the included software instruments are really usable and the level of control relative to all things midi is really hard to beat. For instance, the EXS-24 sampler will work with almost all formats of samples, and the manipulation (unlike hardware samplers) is very easy.

Combined with a logic control, work goes smoothly with few hiccups.

The guys are right about memory issues, there never seems to be enough.........